Interview with a Book Designer: Jazmin Welch—Part Two
"You could design other things ... but what would you do without books?"
This is part two of my conversation with book designer Jazmin Welch. Read part one here.
Nathaniel Roy: Even just two interviews in, I’m noticing some commonalities in the freelance life—down to an obsession with spreadsheets and an analysis of each month’s income needs.
Jazmin: Oh, I did a full hourly breakdown of my year because I really want to make the freelance business work long term. Like, I don’t think I’ll ever end up in an office anymore. If I want to be doing this when I’m 50, and I don't want to be working over 40-hour weeks anymore, then what? How do I figure this out? A long term plan is in my spreadsheets too.
Meanwhile I’m struggling to remember to time my projects—and when I do remember to time, I forget to hit stop.
In freelance book design, I think you often see designers who take one of two tacts for their practice. I refer to them as A) a service business, or B) a person designer. And I think service business book design tends to focus more on independent clients, where a “person designer” might be a more traditional freelancer, working with publishers. And I think the way you position yourself—and correct me if I’m wrong—is more of a service business.
But there’s also very much a person, Jaz, at the heart of what you do and what you post on the internet. And so I was curious, did you think much about that distinction when you were forming your business? What draws you to working with the self published and independent authors as the service type business, rather than being sort of behind the scenes as a freelancer. Is it the type of work? Is it the money? Is it just a natural inclination? What went into that distinction for you?
I think for me, it was just a natural shaping of the business. I definitely wanted to feel like a company, even though it was always just me. I use the term entrepreneur or self-employed more than I do freelancer because I’m not just behind the scenes at a press where someone’s hired me to just do the design, I’m walking clients through the whole publishing process. I think that’s been a helpful distinction in my business as well, because I have worked in-house, trade side at a publishing house. I can bring that knowledge to help the self-published folks I work with, including walking them through elements outside of book design such as the professional editorial process and the necessity of proofreading or what they could expect if they did get a publishing deal.
Though I’m not offering a full suite of self-publishing services, because I’m not interested in charging for KDP services and want to focus on what I love most, which is book design. I do think sharing knowledge on the self-publishing process helps people come to my site, see me, and see me as a knowledgeable person in all those areas, and not just someone that you’re hiring to do a job. You’re hiring me to do your cover, but you know that comes with expertise and a friendly, passionate person to clarify the steps in the self-publishing process and help walk you through it. I did start my business thinking that I would need to offer those things to make the finances work.
And I think that offering end-to-end services is definitely a viable way to approach a book design business. You can do all those uploads to KDP or IngramSpark, you do consulting time. You help them with distribution websites, the whole thing. Doing those things as paid services isn’t really my jam and there are many wonderful book coaches for that, but I am always happy to walk my authors through those things to help them with the self-publishing steps, and I include uploads to POD services as part of my design process. I do think that that was a choice to put myself out there as, I guess, a thought leader. That’s not the right word. But just someone who’s sharing open source information. I do believe in, again, transparency, telling people how things work. So that’s where I kind of started with all those explainer videos that I have up on my Instagram.
This leads me to something I wanted to ask you about—you do post a lot of videos to Instagram. Do you enjoy doing that, or do you sort of view it as a necessary evil to get more eyes on your work because Instagram prioritizes video so much? What have you learned from making those videos?
It’s a love-hate relationship. I don’t love social media—and that's why you'll see long periods where I don’t do videos. Because I’m burnt out. I’m in my business, doing work, and I’m not focused on anything external to the business. But people do find me on Instagram. I don’t have a huge following, but I think for whatever reason when you have a niche and you’re posting consistently about the thing that you do, it does help whether or not you’re famous on Instagram. You know, I’m not going to get an insane amount of leads by Instagram with my following and my little reach, but I do get the occasional person coming into DMs who appreciates what I’m doing and ends up becoming a client.
I’m thinking about longevity too. If I’m this person that’s sharing a wealth of knowledge—if I do eventually want to release some kind of course or deliverable—then I could use that as evergreen content. People will know that I’ve been at this for a while. It’s kind of like this long game, if you will.
I do find it a helpful resource to see what people are asking me. l’ll just have conversations on Instagram openly, and I find those really helpful for my own personal understanding of where authors are coming from and where they’re at as well as what kind of information they need or are missing from their Google searches. Posting that content is sort of like market research. But it’s certainly not for the vanity metrics of likes and follows, because I know that I’m not necessarily hitting on what the algorithm wants.
But sometimes I’m just over it and want to be off social media, too.
That makes me happy to hear, honestly. Sometimes I see your videos and I’m like, “should I be doing this?” But I I just cannot, for the life of me, do anything like that consistently enough, because I just get to a point where I don’t give a shit. I think you need a certain drive and a sort of mission, for lack of a better word.
Let’s talk about publishing in Canada vs. the U.S. You taught me this: In Canada, ISBNs are free for residents. That kind of blew my mind. Are you aware of any other differences in publishing between our two countries?
One of the biggest differences is the funding structure. The Canadian book industry is primarily funded by grants. When I see small indie American publishers on Instagram, they’re reaching out for donations from the public. Up here, I don’t think you see that as often, because we have Canada Council funding. But it’s not the best system—it’s constantly getting cut, of course, and you know the arts are always finishing last. It also has all these stipulations on how you can spend the money. And sometimes these funding bodies seem a little out of touch about what publishers actually need. They’ll say, “here’s $30K to spend on author tours.” And the publisher will say “author tours make very few book sales. You’re just selling a couple copies at each event. Can we use that money for something else that will actually sell the books?”
I don’t think the American government does as much funding, but I do think other aspects of the publishing industry are easier to operate in the U.S. just simply because of the population density which makes for cheaper distribution. There are also more affordable printing options, improvements in print-on-demand, and using the American dollar makes it harder for us to print down there.
But other than that, I don’t know if there are too many differences. I haven’t studied much about whether or not there are differences in cover designs or things like that, though I know each market will have different design tastes.
Earlier this year, you invited me to join the Book Designer Collective. I’ve found a lot of meaning in this little group, this little community that you started, right? What made you want to start it?
Yeah! I run it with Kristy Hill, another book designer out of Vancouver. We both came from The Self Publishing Agency background of working with agencies and self-published folks.
Kristy and I started chatting about issues in the industry and really bonded over it. We despised how much we saw authors getting charged for very fast, simple self-publishing services. We had been brainstorming business ideas and various ways to tackle industry issues, and I loved the idea of and the word “collective.” It feels comforting to me. It’s collaborative, it’s connection, it’s building something together.
So I floated the idea of the collective by Kristy if she wanted to get a group together with me. And then I started posting it on Instagram. I think I sent one post out and got like, 18 responses, so I immediately didn’t talk about it again, because that felt like enough for the moment. Since I was already connected with so many book designers online, I did invite a select few personally who were in similar circles—like you.
I’ve loved it so far. Everybody brings interesting backgrounds to the world of book design, because we all came at it from such different worlds. One of our members did their fellowship at Chronicle Books!
We talked about finances on the call yesterday because Kory asked, “How’s everybody doing? Let's check in.” I’ve really been enjoying the community aspect of it. It really feels like we’re in this thing together and we’ve got each other’s backs. The knowledge shares of various resources, design methodologies, and tips has been invaluable.
For what it’s worth, I’ve enjoyed the hell out of it so far. It’s been such a lovely resource. And you know, when you’re not in house, freelancing can be a little isolating. Sometimes you want to complain about a client and the people in your life have no idea what you’re complaining about because it’s so specific to book design. So whether it’s for griping or support, so far I found everyone’s so kind. Maybe because it’s, like, 60% Canadian.
I love that about book design, too. I’ve said this before in other places, but I think because book design is not a highly-paid profession, what you’re left with are people that love it. So we’re here to chat books. We’re not just doing it for the money. Nobody’s doing it for the money. So you’re left with a bunch of fun folks that absolutely love books, which is really nice.
It’s great to have a space for people to gather and it not be necessarily mediated by social media. I also have a love-hate relationship with Instagram. It has maybe been a net negative for my mental health, but I wouldn’t be where I am in my book design career without it. My first real freelance work came out of my posting a fake cover for The Great Gatsby.
On this note of positivity, I want to talk about some of your favorite things. On that Print Design Podcast episode you talked about some of your favorite projects. But it’s been a few years. As of today, what would you say is your favorite project?
Oh my gosh, so many. I think I hadn’t done any cookbooks at the time of that podcast. They’re such a interesting challenge, and they’re so much fun. There are quite a few books that I really love! I’m looking at my website now. It’s honestly been a really busy year.
Right now, I’m working on a series of 9 textbooks for a children’s hospital. It’s a very unique project. The woman who runs it is this powerhouse based in Dublin that I worked with on a book about Cerebral Palsy. Her son has CP, so she decided to write a very comprehensive book on it for families, and it was wildly successful. So now she’s producing books in the same format for the 9 most prevalent physical disabilities for families, that are being co-published with an Irish publisher and a Children’s Hospital based in Minneapolis. The project itself, design wise, isn’t wildly exciting, as it’s meant to be an extremely clear, friendly, and accessible read—though that is a fun challenge in itself—but working on such a rewarding project with such an incredible team has been really wonderful.

I think whenever I get to paint a cover it’s always a joy for me. It doesn’t happen often, because I couldn’tt just be painting all the covers, they would start to look the same! But I always get a kick out of getting to paint. I have one coming out next season. And like I mentioned on the podcast, I love designing journals.
My Volcano is one of my favorite covers, because it is painted and kind of wild. It’s got a sort of glitch effect on it. It was a really close collaboration with John Elizabeth Stintzi (JES), the author, and their work is just so interesting, intricate and kind of wild and off the wall. I have worked on so many books now where my collaboration with the author has led to a much stronger and exciting cover.
I got to be really creative with that cover. I actually like all of the other options we were playing with, too. I think there’s like 30 random art pieces, collages, paintings on my computer that were just so fun to make. This book was an example of when you’re in that pure creative flow state and you’re having a blast.
For me, there’s no better feeling when you send out for roundup covers and you're like, “I’d be happy if any of these are chosen.” It’s not always the case.
More favorites: What’s your favorite book?
Oh my gosh. My personal favorite genre is the stuff about human nature, where we come from, the brain. I love neuroscience stuff. I really enjoyed the book The Man Who Wasn’t There. It goes into the brain-body connection and the various disconnections that can happen. It’s wildly fascinating! I also love, love, love Braiding Sweetgrass. That’s a bestseller for a reason—that book is so good. I got the hardcover special edition of it after reading it on audio. I needed it to live in my house and I plan on reading it again soon!
I’m pretty sure I know the answer to this, but it’s something I’m asking everybody because I put a poll on Instagram last year, and the results were fascinating.
Would you rather never read a book again or never design a book again?
I would never design again if I had to choose. Partially because you could design other things, right? You can figure that side out. But what would you do without books?
I’m right there with you. It’s fascinating when someone says they’d never read one again. I’m like, then, why the hell are you doing this work? Like, how did you get into this? The only reason I wanted to design them was because I loved reading them. So I can’t wait to talk to people who give the opposite response. So I can just be like, “let me into your brain.”
I just love my library. I grew up with a very artistic mom and nan. I have a lot of nan’s old artist books. I’m able to peruse through them for an endless wealth of inspiration. And poetry—it would be like giving up any other art form, really. Would you want to never look at a piece of art again? That’s how it is for me. It’s a part of the human experience that enriches our lives, getting to dive into other people’s worlds and learn new things.
What is something you wish more people knew about book design?
Off the top of my head, I would say I wish people knew how much time is invested into it—how much love and care goes into it. And it’s not just making a flyer for a product. I think a lot of us treat them as art projects.
If you’re working with a self-published author, you’re also doing rounds of feedback. You’re doing the front, back cover, and spine. The press checks can take a really long time. Looking at the proofs can take a really long time. So when you’re talking about trying to whittle down someone’s fee, there are just endless hours that I feel like are often not even captured in that fee.
And often, we’re reading the book too. We are not billing for that time. I wish authors knew that’s not even part of the scope. We’re reading your book because we love what we do! I think a lot of people don’t even realize that book designers will read. I get people coming to me who say “I want to work with you because you read the book!” And I say, “who have you talked to that says they won’t?”
I will say that it depends on the book for me. If it’s a really academic nonfiction title, I’m probably not reading it. And I do more nonfiction design. For a while I thought I’d be the person who reads everything, like you, but I’m just not. I will read a novel, though, or at least part of it. I really applaud you for that!
Some nonfiction is different, though, like you said. I couldn’t possibly have the time to read a 500-page law textbook. You sometimes don’t need to read the whole thing to design it and often with non-fiction, when we start the design, the only element available is some sample chapters and a proposal which of course I read in full. For fiction though, I do think as designers we need to read the whole book to pick up nuance and catch small details, elements and metaphors that could make for an exciting cover.
Also if I read everything I don’t think I’d have time to read anything else! And I like reading too much to only read for work.
Sometimes the nonfiction books I read, I basically make it into an audiobook. You can convert it to an ebook from the Word file and then I use the accessibility features on my phone to read it to me while I’m doing the dishes or something with my notebook open for notes. I can’t get really immersed in fiction through an audiobook for some reason though.
Work smarter not harder.
But I have to be focused, otherwise I’m not paying attention at all. I was working on a journal about ethical divorce and listening to it at home. My husband overheard it a few times and was like, “it’s the divorce robot, again” in a robot voice [laughs]. My phone’s synthetic voice reading to me about divorce made the book sound infinitely sadder than it was!
On that incredible note, that’s my conversation with Jazmin Welch. Thanks so much to Jaz for taking the time to talk shop and share what she knows with me and the world.
Book a free discovery call with Jazmin here.
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A Book Designer’s Notebook is a newsletter about book design and creative practice from the desk of Nathaniel Roy.
It uses the typefaces Merriweather, Futura, and whatever fonts Substack has chosen. Merriweather is a Google font designed to be a text face that is pleasant to read on screens. Futura is geometric sans-serif designed by Paul Renner in 1927. It is on the moon.
Nathaniel Roy is a book designer, collage maker, photo taker, self publisher, and a few other things in Ypsilanti, Michigan.
You can see his work and hire him here.